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  • Writer's pictureJohn Robertson

Let's Debate: Pedagogy vs Andragogy...

Updated: Jul 25, 2022


Let’s talk learning theories today. A lot of the feedback I have received so far is leaning heavy towards “pedagogy has its place John. We are teaching initial skills so that is what we should be using to teach initial training because that is what pedagogy is used for” (paraphrased from several diverse readers of this very opinionated, yet fact-based BLOG)


Let me start out by saying, all of you are wrong.


Wait what? That seems a little crazy that you are just calling people wrong John. Are you saying that pedagogy isn’t a viable teaching method?


No, I’m not saying that at all. To be clear, I am saying that if you have a group of highly developed, specifically assessed and selected personnel whom the nation will count on to solve extremely complex problems in high stress situations (see previous blog about SWTW’s mission statement) then we should not be training them like children. We should train them like adults… why? Because that is how we will save time and effort over time and breed a culture of life-long learners, high proficiency, and expertise.


If you are mad at this point that I have said you’re wrong, that is fine… you can stop reading… OR you can continue reading and at least see my perspective using evidence-based practices to support my perspective and opinion.


The most likely origin of the word seems to be that Kapp simply amended the existing word pedagogy by changing the reference from children to men. The literal meaning of the term pedagogy is the leadership of children, though it is understood as “the art and practice of teaching” (Oxford English Dictionary, 2005). Andragogy builds on the Greek roots of the word pedagogy and would mean something like the art and practice of teaching men. (Clair & Käpplinger, 2021)

Okay… so why did I just throw a quote at you on definitions? This is so we start from common ground. Pedagogy literally translates into two different Greek words peda- or “children” and -agogue “leader or bringer”. So we can easily assess that pedagogy is meant to mean “leader of children” and we can basically ignore what the 2005 oxford dictionary states which is the art and practice of teaching… since that definition leaves out the fact that it is the art and practice of teaching children. Why is this important John? Why are you wasting my time with definitions? Well, it is important that we understand the difference between the two. Because they both have their place in education… one favors children and the other favors adults.


Okay, so what is the difference between a child and an adult? Well that is extremely complicated in today's world. But I can say that the modern definition of child is: a young human being below the age of puberty or below the legal age of majority (Oxford Dictionary, 2022). In addition, the definition of an adult is: a person who is fully grown or developed (Oxford Dictionary, 2022).


 

So that doesn’t help us out too much. Let’s go with the good ol’ John’s definition of each:


A child is a human that depends on an adult for basic needs (food, shelter, and water) and has not yet fully developed their body and mind to comprehend the consequences of their actions in the world they interact. (this will not be found in any book… but it should sum up my points)


An adult is a human that has developed to be able to provide for themselves in the basic categories and is capable of understanding the basic consequences of their actions in the world the commonly interact with. (again, no reference… but you should get the context)



 

Thanks for the paragraphs on definitions… what is the purpose of this post?


The purpose is to establish that there is a distinguishable difference between the practice of pedagogy and andragogy… bear with me here.


As an adult learner, you expect to be treated like an adult. You expect that the information that you receive in an instructional setting will be applicable to your daily practice in performance of your duty or job. Simply put, if I teach you something as an adult, it should be something that you can go and use immediately. If you can’t use it immediately, we are back to the penguins on the island theory and you are going to push something off of the island to keep that knowledge in there.


They often say, you can’t teach an old dog new tricks… why is that? Well and old dog knows what they need to know about the environment they live in. If you took an old dog and put them into a new house with new owners and new rules, I would hypothesize that they would adapt and/or learn new tricks right? Why is that? Well, the dog would understand that the new rules are vital to the performance of their daily tasks or jobs. So… it is immediately applicable to their environment.


Here is a basic question to my friends and colleagues that are in charge of training our brand new accessions into Air Force Special Warfare Career Fields: If we are spending $$XX,XXX.XX on running a brand new Basic Trainee through a XX-day assessment and selection process that evaluates XX attributes that are scored against an objective criteria and validated by occupational psychologists; why are we training them like high-school students?
- Are we not assessing the right things?
- What do we need to add to an assessment to prove that the candidate has the ability to “learn and adapt” quickly and efficiently?

I would again assume that we are actually assessing for those things because our customer has a timeline that we have to meet right? So that individual that we are assessing and selecting has been deemed "appropriate” for the career field they are then assigned to and expected to complete their training pipeline to produce a qualified AFSPECWAR Airman on the backside… so why are we wasting our time training them like a child???? (see definition of pedagogy)


Andragogy is not just a practice that is meant to put people in high-stress environments and give them “unsolvable problems” from the beginning of their training. On the contrary, andragogy is a method of teaching that allows for our training entities to tailor the training to the adult learner that fosters a culture of self-reflection and mindfulness and provides them with practical knowledge that they can immediately apply.


In practice, what does that mean John? In practice, that means that if I do sit that individual down and make them sit through a powerpoint presentation on how to program a radio I can’t stop at the lecture itself. I MUST go into some sort of practice period. That practice period can’t be days later in a stressful environment. I need to give them experiences (See previous post about experiences) that will help them build a mental model of the problem set. Those mental models will be stored away in their memories (long-term at this point) so that they can be quickly accessed and used to take new material and turn far-transfer problems (no mental model exist to base new knowledge off of) into short-transfer problems (some mental model exists to relate new knowledge to).


To summarize, let’s take the culture of how we are teaching our Airmen and transform it into following some basics of teaching adults and actually treat our Airmen like adults… Here are a few guiding posts for all of us to think about when designing for the adult learner:


The andragogical approach to practice is spelled out at some length in “Modern Practice” and many contributions by Knowles and other authors. It initially centered on four assumptions about adults and their learning: (Clair & Käpplinger, 2021)
Self-concept. Adults are used to being self-determining, and adult education must recognize this in its approach. (Clair & Käpplinger, 2021) We need to keep the adult in mind and make sure we are tailoring our approach to learning with the adult at the center… we are training our future replacements right? (this is what we are told all the time) So treat them like your future replacements.
Experience. Adults bring experience to education, and this should be acknowledged as a valuable resource. (Clair & Käpplinger, 2021) Some of you will find this hard to swallow. How does a kid from <insert random town USA> bring experience to my classroom? Well, you need to again realize that all of your students have a past. They all come from a vast background and knowledge-base. Use that knowledge-base to your advantage and help them build mental models as they work through problems… oh and by the way, they will probably have something to teach you, even if they are some small little 18-year old that hasn’t ever seen combat like you have… get over yourself!
Readiness to learn. Adults have a greater or lesser readiness to learn based on their individual and social context. (Clair & Käpplinger, 2021) You 100% can instill their readiness to learn by using your own experience (now you can flex that combat experience) to teach your students and give them relevance. Think about this in each class you teach from here on out and ask yourself this question as a student when you start designing content… “Why am I here and Why do I care?” if you can’t answer these two questions, you are wasting everyone’s time!
Orientation to learning. For adults, learning is about problem solving, and education needs to demonstrate application to be seen as a good use of time. (Clair & Käpplinger, 2021) Again, if your student cannot go and apply their newly instructed skills immediately after teaching… they will not value your information… go back to Bloom’s taxonomy of learning and look at the affective side of the pyramids… if they don’t value what you’re saying why are they going to cognitively retain any knowledge at all? It is penguins on the island at that point and they have to decide if a penguin stays or goes.
The need to know. It is necessary for adults to be aware of why they need to know something. (Clair & Käpplinger, 2021) STOP GETTING MAD AT STUDENT’S ASKING WHY!!! Just because your kid asks this question 1,000,000,000 times in the span of 60-seconds and it annoys you. Remember, you are training a human that is going to be put through the exact situations you were put through… you have an opportunity to shape them and guide them prior to them getting into the same situation. But, since you gave them the “why” in training, they didn’t have to figure that out on their own, under fire, in the highest stress environment imaginable… see where I am going?
Motivation. Internal motivators are the strongest for adult learners, even though their intrinsic drive to learn may have been dampened by life experience. (Clair & Käpplinger, 2021) Find what motivates your students… I guarantee that if you can relate it to real-life experience, they will be motivated to want to do the same things or be better than you. In addition to this, BE THE EXAMPLE!!! Set the example for your students to follow. Don’t be a dirt-bag. Don’t try to be their friend… take on the role of mentor instead and guide them to greatness… be the guy they strive to be in life and in job.

Wow, that is a lot to digest.


Bottom-line, the idea of Andragogy is contentious in the L&D, Human Performance, and Education worlds. I don’t care about that. I only care that we are training our Airmen to be the best and brightest so they can go and do the hardest jobs when called upon by our nation to do so. I’m not trying to be patriotic at this point but real. I had to learn a lot of lessons on my own under-fire, while lives were on the line because the training that I was initially put through was not set up to give me the experiences I needed for my toolkit. They were there to take a checklist, turn the red squares green, and send me out the door… WE ARE STILL DOING THAT TODAY!!!


While I have written this mainly for my current military audience the practices are applicable to all adult-learners in all fields. I promise.


References

Clair, S. R., & Käpplinger, B. (2021). Alley or Autobahn? Assessing 50 Years of the Andragogical Project. Adult Education Quarterly, 71(3), 272-289. Retrieved July 20, 2022, from https://web-p-ebscohost-com.libproxy.boisestate.edu/ehost/pdfviewer/pdfviewer?vid=9&sid=0c7dc81a-828f-477c-8c24-326fb03a17bf%40redis


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